There were only pleasant impressions from the rest in this hotel and in the resort of Sarykamysh. The hotel is located next to the slope. Pine trees all around. A lot of snow. High mountain. Trails of different levels but not very difficult. Great skating! The hotel has a large cozy lobby. There is a fireplace.
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There were only pleasant impressions from the rest in this hotel and in the resort of Sarykamysh. The hotel is located next to the slope. Pine trees all around. A lot of snow. High mountain. Trails of different levels but not very difficult. Great skating! The hotel has a large cozy lobby. There is a fireplace. There is live music in the evenings. Food at the level in the best Turkish traditions. There is a nice swimming pool, sauna, hammam. Rooms are spacious with mountain views. Everything is fine. I recommend!
Review from — vOtpusk.ru
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I read reviews about Sarykamysh and was just upset - well, did anyone really like it ?? We were there for 9 days and were pleasantly surprised by both the hotel and the service. I must say that in that area (and possibly even in this part of the country) this hotel seems to be the only one. We traveled in a large group (for those who are interested, there is a detailed report with photos, etc.
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I read reviews about Sarykamysh and was just upset - well, did anyone really like it ??
We were there for 9 days and were pleasantly surprised by both the hotel and the service. I must say that in that area (and possibly even in this part of the country) this hotel seems to be the only one.
We traveled in a large group (for those who are interested, there is a detailed report with photos, etc. , we probably didn’t get bored in the evenings. But I think if we were alone, then there’s absolutely nothing to do in the hotel in the evening.
Tourists - Russians, Ukrainians and Turks.
As for the main thing - the mountain. The slopes are perfect for families with children. Our 5-year-old son got on skis there and rolled down the "black" hill (on the map it is "black" in real life, of course, not, and so, with "black" differences in length of 50 meters : -)) and was very proud of himself - very well! Now from loves skiing. If we had taken him, for example, to Germany or Italy, I think love would definitely not work out. The resort is not suitable for extreme sportsmen - 100%, but for lovers of average driving with children - it's just perfect, we took skis with us from Kyiv (comp. "SITA" carried them in luggage for free), on the spot the rental was something ok. 20 or 25 dollars / day.
About food. We have a family "with greetings" - we are picky people. And, believe me, I have nothing bad to say. In the restaurant, we sat down in the same place, we were lucky with the waiter - he always had a joyful smile)) and readiness to cover and clean. In the morning it even cheered up : -)
Children's room - I was there only a "run", but our son (he sometimes stayed there during the day after dinner instead of the mountain) VERY liked it. Can't say exactly what. . .
Room cleaning is excellent. It was evident that the comrade was simply climbing out of his skin. After the tip, he broke into a smile and did everything perfectly.
Settlement. Well, it didn’t happen that we didn’t move yet : -) My husband looked at the first number and, of course, went to change (I know these jokes and while he doesn’t give the “go-ahead” I generally sit in the lobby : -)) the second number is something better, they stayed in it with a view: mountains, pines, snow, crystal air... An idiot's dream))
Alcohol - several people complained that it was not given more than a glass. I don’t know, we sat down for dinner sometimes with a group and they brought it to us without any questions. Sometimes even after the end of dinner (when, in principle, they no longer feed or drink) - for $ 1. But I don’t know how anyone, but I, if the waiter brings me anything at all at any time, I always give him a little money...
Of the other amenities - there is a pool that is always almost half empty (somehow the Turks did not like it) and several saunas, wet and dry (like two each) with a common exit to the "hole" - in the inner small "courtyard" there is a small deep pool with a flowing, so as not to freeze, with ice water. After sauna - heavenly pleasure! ! The Turks did not do this, as far as I saw, but "Crazy Russian" - with might and main!
In general, I’m ready to tune in positively and go, it’s better with friends, the hotel has wonderful halls (it’s like a huge pine log house with heavy leather furniture and fireplaces, natural stone and tapestries), in which it’s so good to relax after a day of skiing, with a cup of coffee or a glass guilt. I advise!
We were there for 9 days and were pleasantly surprised by both the hotel and the service. I must say that in that area (and possibly even in this part of the country) this hotel seems to be the only one.
We traveled in a large group (for those who are interested, there is a detailed report with photos, etc. , we probably didn’t get bored in the evenings. But I think if we were alone, then there’s absolutely nothing to do in the hotel in the evening.
Tourists - Russians, Ukrainians and Turks.
As for the main thing - the mountain. The slopes are perfect for families with children. Our 5-year-old son got on skis there and rolled down the "black" hill (on the map it is "black" in real life, of course, not, and so, with "black" differences in length of 50 meters : -)) and was very proud of himself - very well! Now from loves skiing. If we had taken him, for example, to Germany or Italy, I think love would definitely not work out. The resort is not suitable for extreme sportsmen - 100%, but for lovers of average driving with children - it's just perfect, we took skis with us from Kyiv (comp. "SITA" carried them in luggage for free), on the spot the rental was something ok. 20 or 25 dollars / day.
About food. We have a family "with greetings" - we are picky people. And, believe me, I have nothing bad to say. In the restaurant, we sat down in the same place, we were lucky with the waiter - he always had a joyful smile)) and readiness to cover and clean. In the morning it even cheered up : -)
Children's room - I was there only a "run", but our son (he sometimes stayed there during the day after dinner instead of the mountain) VERY liked it. Can't say exactly what. . .
Room cleaning is excellent. It was evident that the comrade was simply climbing out of his skin. After the tip, he broke into a smile and did everything perfectly.
Settlement. Well, it didn’t happen that we didn’t move yet : -) My husband looked at the first number and, of course, went to change (I know these jokes and while he doesn’t give the “go-ahead” I generally sit in the lobby : -)) the second number is something better, they stayed in it with a view: mountains, pines, snow, crystal air... An idiot's dream))
Alcohol - several people complained that it was not given more than a glass. I don’t know, we sat down for dinner sometimes with a group and they brought it to us without any questions. Sometimes even after the end of dinner (when, in principle, they no longer feed or drink) - for $ 1. But I don’t know how anyone, but I, if the waiter brings me anything at all at any time, I always give him a little money...
Of the other amenities - there is a pool that is always almost half empty (somehow the Turks did not like it) and several saunas, wet and dry (like two each) with a common exit to the "hole" - in the inner small "courtyard" there is a small deep pool with a flowing, so as not to freeze, with ice water. After sauna - heavenly pleasure! ! The Turks did not do this, as far as I saw, but "Crazy Russian" - with might and main!
In general, I’m ready to tune in positively and go, it’s better with friends, the hotel has wonderful halls (it’s like a huge pine log house with heavy leather furniture and fireplaces, natural stone and tapestries), in which it’s so good to relax after a day of skiing, with a cup of coffee or a glass guilt. I advise!
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Thank God there was enough snow. The trouble is that the tracks are poorly prepared, there is a high probability of getting injured, the water in the pool is dirty.
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Thank God there was enough snow. The trouble is that the tracks are poorly prepared, there is a high probability of getting injured, the water in the pool is dirty.
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We went to the hotel for the second time, the first last year. One negative. Everything has changed for the worse. The fact that there was no snow, the hotel is certainly not to blame. There were no guns and no. Failed to ride. The hotel itself has changed the concept of food. Of alcoholic beverages, one glass of beer or wine at lunch and dinner (sometimes half a glass, as lucky).
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We went to the hotel for the second time, the first last year. One negative. Everything has changed for the worse. The fact that there was no snow, the hotel is certainly not to blame. There were no guns and no. Failed to ride. The hotel itself has changed the concept of food. Of alcoholic beverages, one glass of beer or wine at lunch and dinner (sometimes half a glass, as lucky). For alcohol we went to the village, about 5 km one way. We were not ready for such a turn of events, tour. the SITA operator did not warn about the changes. The culmination of the holiday was the solemn commemoration of their army, frozen in these mountains during the 1st World War, held directly at the hotel on 6.01. 11 On this day, without warning, all vacationers were driven out into the street during lunch, such as a barbecue. Armchairs for donating blood were installed in the lobby of the hotel, and local residents who came from everywhere gave it in front of adults and children. In general - oil painting! The probability of holding a wake at the hotel next year is high, since the hotel is owned by the state. And another important point, during our tour, the cleaner at the hotel attempted to rape a vacationer. Draw your own conclusions.
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The fact that there was no snow is understandable - this is nature, but the attitude of the hotel manager just amazed me! From the 31st on the first snow fell, the hotel refused to rent out skis, because. they are new and the Turks were afraid that we would scratch them! With a fight, we managed to take skis in a nearby 3 * hotel.
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The fact that there was no snow is understandable - this is nature, but the attitude of the hotel manager just amazed me! From the 31st on the first snow fell, the hotel refused to rent out skis, because. they are new and the Turks were afraid that we would scratch them! With a fight, we managed to take skis in a nearby 3 * hotel. The food leaves much to be desired. New Year's Eve in general - sucks full! I do not recommend this hotel!
Tea 3 dollars, mulled wine 7 dollars, photography 370 dollars, for 100 - they didn’t give it back!
Tea 3 dollars, mulled wine 7 dollars, photography 370 dollars, for 100 - they didn’t give it back!
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• 2.5
Good afternoon everyone! From 27.12. 10 to 3.01. 2011! I was in Turkey 5 times, almost everywhere, in Egypt, Holland, Spain, Belgium, there is something to compare with! At the ski for the first time! But this hotel is something! At the airport we were met with the words: "The bus is delayed and you are not in a hurry, there is still no snow"! The agency swore that he was always here! Should have been a full board with a plus! In practice! Breakfast, lunch, dinner, no questions, everything is delicious, not enough, but you can survive! As for the included drinks, they didn’t turn anything on, everything has changed, alcohol is included (a glass of beer or wine to choose from) There is not even water for free! Only at lunch, dinner, breakfast! The rest of the time everything is paid, tea, coffee, etc! In general, judge for yourself! When you called the agency, we can't do anything! Here's your holiday for the New Year!! !.
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Good afternoon everyone! From 27.12. 10 to 3.01. 2011!
I was in Turkey 5 times, almost everywhere, in Egypt, Holland, Spain, Belgium, there is something to compare with! At the ski for the first time!
But this hotel is something! At the airport we were met with the words: "The bus is delayed and you are not in a hurry, there is still no snow"! The agency swore that he was always here! Should have been a full board with a plus!
In practice! Breakfast, lunch, dinner, no questions, everything is delicious, not enough, but you can survive! As for the included drinks, they didn’t turn anything on, everything has changed, alcohol is included (a glass of beer or wine to choose from)
There is not even water for free! Only at lunch, dinner, breakfast! The rest of the time everything is paid, tea, coffee, etc!
In general, judge for yourself! When you called the agency, we can't do anything! Here's your holiday for the New Year!! !
I was in Turkey 5 times, almost everywhere, in Egypt, Holland, Spain, Belgium, there is something to compare with! At the ski for the first time!
But this hotel is something! At the airport we were met with the words: "The bus is delayed and you are not in a hurry, there is still no snow"! The agency swore that he was always here! Should have been a full board with a plus!
In practice! Breakfast, lunch, dinner, no questions, everything is delicious, not enough, but you can survive! As for the included drinks, they didn’t turn anything on, everything has changed, alcohol is included (a glass of beer or wine to choose from)
There is not even water for free! Only at lunch, dinner, breakfast! The rest of the time everything is paid, tea, coffee, etc!
In general, judge for yourself! When you called the agency, we can't do anything! Here's your holiday for the New Year!! !
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• 4.5
We were at the hotel from 04.01. 09 to 15.01. 09. The hotel is quite nice, cozy. Food is normal (in my opinion). Service is average. Bathrobes were brought on the second day, slippers on the fourth, but these are trifles. There is a swimming pool, but for me the water is cold, there are saunas, billiards, table tennis.
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We were at the hotel from 04.01. 09 to 15.01. 09.
The hotel is quite nice, cozy. Food is normal (in my opinion). Service is average. Bathrobes were brought on the second day, slippers on the fourth, but these are trifles.
There is a swimming pool, but for me the water is cold, there are saunas, billiards, table tennis. But it's boring in the evenings, it's better to go with a company.
Of the real problems, the dollar-to-lira exchange rate is simply extortionate. If the exchange rate in the village was more than 1.5, then at the reception it was 1.1, and in the cafe on the hill it was even steeper - one to one. You need to change money at the bank in Sarykamysh itself. Another problem is it is very problematic to exchange big money for small ones. Moreover, the logic of the problem is completely incomprehensible - we change it in order to give them something to tip. As a result, we were left without a tip a couple of times.
The most important thing is that there is snow!!! ! The first four days it snowed and it fell a lot.
Experienced skiers will probably be bored, but just right for us.
there are few people, there are no queues. Only on Saturday from 11 to 13 there was a queue for 5 minutes maximum, and this despite the fact that buses from Palandoken came every day and brought people to ride. They had practically no snow and most of the lifts did not work. As a result, some tourists moved to our hotel.
The rental costs $ 20, but we took it with us (we rented houses - it turned out to be quite a savings). Skis and boots were left in the ski room for free.
The coolest thing is that the lift is 50 meters from the hotel. I went down in the morning in slippers, changed my shoes, took my skis and..... you are already on the lift.
In general, the impressions were the most positive.
The hotel is quite nice, cozy. Food is normal (in my opinion). Service is average. Bathrobes were brought on the second day, slippers on the fourth, but these are trifles.
There is a swimming pool, but for me the water is cold, there are saunas, billiards, table tennis. But it's boring in the evenings, it's better to go with a company.
Of the real problems, the dollar-to-lira exchange rate is simply extortionate. If the exchange rate in the village was more than 1.5, then at the reception it was 1.1, and in the cafe on the hill it was even steeper - one to one. You need to change money at the bank in Sarykamysh itself. Another problem is it is very problematic to exchange big money for small ones. Moreover, the logic of the problem is completely incomprehensible - we change it in order to give them something to tip. As a result, we were left without a tip a couple of times.
The most important thing is that there is snow!!! ! The first four days it snowed and it fell a lot.
Experienced skiers will probably be bored, but just right for us.
there are few people, there are no queues. Only on Saturday from 11 to 13 there was a queue for 5 minutes maximum, and this despite the fact that buses from Palandoken came every day and brought people to ride. They had practically no snow and most of the lifts did not work. As a result, some tourists moved to our hotel.
The rental costs $ 20, but we took it with us (we rented houses - it turned out to be quite a savings). Skis and boots were left in the ski room for free.
The coolest thing is that the lift is 50 meters from the hotel. I went down in the morning in slippers, changed my shoes, took my skis and..... you are already on the lift.
In general, the impressions were the most positive.
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A wonderful vacation began with a delay of a charter flight for 7 hours. Then instead of the promised half-hour drive to the resort - 2 hours. But all the negativity disappeared already at the sight of the hotel lobby. Lots of wood and marble. The beauty. We only arrived for dinner. The food was excellent throughout the stay.
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A wonderful vacation began with a delay of a charter flight for 7 hours. Then instead of the promised half-hour drive to the resort - 2 hours. But all the negativity disappeared already at the sight of the hotel lobby. Lots of wood and marble. The beauty.
We only arrived for dinner. The food was excellent throughout the stay. Meat, fish, poultry. Vegetables and fruits (and very tasty, regardless of the off-season). At lunch and dinner, alcoholic drinks of local production - in unlimited quantities. I recommend their wines. White and red wines are of fairly good quality. Beer, only if cold. Rakia - didn't like it. The rest of the drinks are better to take in Duty Free. We took Metaxa, Finland and Jameson, with a total cost of about 80-100 USD. According to the price list, which was in our room, these drinks were pulled out for 600 USD.
Of the entertainment, only what is in the hotel. Go somewhere on the side - just nowhere.
On the second day ski rental and the first disappointment. A set of skis is not the best quality and not the newest - 25 USD. from the nose per day. It's already discounted. If you have your own skis, take them. Or for rent. Friends in Kyiv took a rental for 40 UAH. set. You will need to leave a deposit for ski passes. This is 15-25 USD. thing. It will be given to you on the last day. There are 20 lifts on the ski pass. No matter how hard we tried, we couldn't get it all out. But if you succeed, they will be exchanged at the reception without question.
Now about the tracks - great training tracks!! ! I have never seen the best trails for beginners. There are also reds and blacks, although even at the hotel the staff knows that their blacks are actually gray. Not particularly difficult, but interesting in terms of slope angles. The red one is great! The second is that the Turkish national slalom team periodically trains on it. She's just dead. Went there once and regretted it. The height of the snow cover under the track is 1.5 meters. It used to happen that if someone flew off the track, they dug up the skis for a long time. Now for the lifts. There are no queues. Only on Saturday and Sunday people come from neighboring villages. The queue up to 5 minutes is still quite tolerable. In Bukovel, things are much worse. It is interesting to watch Turkish skiers: in strange ski suits, on straight skis, Turkish skiers rush from a black track in a toilet bowl position without even thinking about turning. I don't want them to run into anyone. Their children are no better. One with me was taken from the red track on a stretcher with broken legs (maybe not only legs) was taken. The sight is terrible. But their rescue service is respect !!!
About the weather. One day it was snowing, it was very cold, we regretted that we did not buy wind masks against the face. Because at first the face was weathered. Then on the second day it snowed so that when you stretched your hand forward it was invisible. And the lifts were closed. After lunch, when the weather returned to normal, the lifts did not open due to snow sticking. On the third day, as the sun shone, in general, weather-beaten faces also began to burn. So stock up on creams. Yes, and without masks it was possible to ride only 2 days.
The view from the mountain is superb. You can see Ararat. A wonderful spectacle.
Also one day there was an excursion from Palandoken. They said that we are better because: more snow, no queues for lifts, although in terms of the level of difficulty of the slopes there, of course, much more interesting. They all asked in turn, where is the black track? But nevertheless, they said that it is better in Sarykamysh!
Service at the hotel - depending on who has a maid. We were given shampoos and other products only in exchange for empty jars (we have such a suspicion). On the other floor, all this was issued every day. A trifle, but somehow funny.
Bathrobes to go to the pool were issued only on the second day after the fourth request. The staff speaks Russian poorly. And if you do not speak English, a guide will help you at the hotel. Even though it didn't do us any good. They all got it themselves. For which on the last day they were named the best vacationers.
The hotel has a large swimming pool. But it has a lot of bleach in it and a couple of times it was hotter than body temperature. Which was at least strange. Nevertheless, there was always enough space for everyone. And it was very beautiful to watch how it snowed outside the window, and you were in the pool.
There is also a sauna with a pool, although it is small and outside. A snowdrift is also at your disposal.
Game room in the evening. Fireplace. The animation is not the best, but. . .
In general, the impressions of the trip are only positive. If we decide to ski in Turkey again, we will definitely go there again.
I wish you a good rest too. And remember, a winter mountain vacation is in no way inferior to a summer one, or maybe even vice versa.
We only arrived for dinner. The food was excellent throughout the stay. Meat, fish, poultry. Vegetables and fruits (and very tasty, regardless of the off-season). At lunch and dinner, alcoholic drinks of local production - in unlimited quantities. I recommend their wines. White and red wines are of fairly good quality. Beer, only if cold. Rakia - didn't like it. The rest of the drinks are better to take in Duty Free. We took Metaxa, Finland and Jameson, with a total cost of about 80-100 USD. According to the price list, which was in our room, these drinks were pulled out for 600 USD.
Of the entertainment, only what is in the hotel. Go somewhere on the side - just nowhere.
On the second day ski rental and the first disappointment. A set of skis is not the best quality and not the newest - 25 USD. from the nose per day. It's already discounted. If you have your own skis, take them. Or for rent. Friends in Kyiv took a rental for 40 UAH. set. You will need to leave a deposit for ski passes. This is 15-25 USD. thing. It will be given to you on the last day. There are 20 lifts on the ski pass. No matter how hard we tried, we couldn't get it all out. But if you succeed, they will be exchanged at the reception without question.
Now about the tracks - great training tracks!! ! I have never seen the best trails for beginners. There are also reds and blacks, although even at the hotel the staff knows that their blacks are actually gray. Not particularly difficult, but interesting in terms of slope angles. The red one is great! The second is that the Turkish national slalom team periodically trains on it. She's just dead. Went there once and regretted it. The height of the snow cover under the track is 1.5 meters. It used to happen that if someone flew off the track, they dug up the skis for a long time. Now for the lifts. There are no queues. Only on Saturday and Sunday people come from neighboring villages. The queue up to 5 minutes is still quite tolerable. In Bukovel, things are much worse. It is interesting to watch Turkish skiers: in strange ski suits, on straight skis, Turkish skiers rush from a black track in a toilet bowl position without even thinking about turning. I don't want them to run into anyone. Their children are no better. One with me was taken from the red track on a stretcher with broken legs (maybe not only legs) was taken. The sight is terrible. But their rescue service is respect !!!
About the weather. One day it was snowing, it was very cold, we regretted that we did not buy wind masks against the face. Because at first the face was weathered. Then on the second day it snowed so that when you stretched your hand forward it was invisible. And the lifts were closed. After lunch, when the weather returned to normal, the lifts did not open due to snow sticking. On the third day, as the sun shone, in general, weather-beaten faces also began to burn. So stock up on creams. Yes, and without masks it was possible to ride only 2 days.
The view from the mountain is superb. You can see Ararat. A wonderful spectacle.
Also one day there was an excursion from Palandoken. They said that we are better because: more snow, no queues for lifts, although in terms of the level of difficulty of the slopes there, of course, much more interesting. They all asked in turn, where is the black track? But nevertheless, they said that it is better in Sarykamysh!
Service at the hotel - depending on who has a maid. We were given shampoos and other products only in exchange for empty jars (we have such a suspicion). On the other floor, all this was issued every day. A trifle, but somehow funny.
Bathrobes to go to the pool were issued only on the second day after the fourth request. The staff speaks Russian poorly. And if you do not speak English, a guide will help you at the hotel. Even though it didn't do us any good. They all got it themselves. For which on the last day they were named the best vacationers.
The hotel has a large swimming pool. But it has a lot of bleach in it and a couple of times it was hotter than body temperature. Which was at least strange. Nevertheless, there was always enough space for everyone. And it was very beautiful to watch how it snowed outside the window, and you were in the pool.
There is also a sauna with a pool, although it is small and outside. A snowdrift is also at your disposal.
Game room in the evening. Fireplace. The animation is not the best, but. . .
In general, the impressions of the trip are only positive. If we decide to ski in Turkey again, we will definitely go there again.
I wish you a good rest too. And remember, a winter mountain vacation is in no way inferior to a summer one, or maybe even vice versa.
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A very good place to relax. The hotel is super, brand new, beautiful, the slopes are good for every taste. And those who write that the tracks are only for dummies probably went sledding. All in all very satisfied with the holiday. I just don't know why it's advertised so badly.
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A very good place to relax. The hotel is super, brand new, beautiful, the slopes are good for every taste. And those who write that the tracks are only for dummies probably went sledding. All in all very satisfied with the holiday. I just don't know why it's advertised so badly.
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in general, the hotel is very good, new, cozy, very stylish, we were a couple of years ago in Uludag at the Agauglu hotel, do not play against. The staff is friendly, the rooms were cleaned normally, the food is delicious (and like a winter ski resort in general, very much : ) However, there were a couple of downsides.
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in general, the hotel is very good, new, cozy, very stylish, we were a couple of years ago in Uludag at the Agauglu hotel, do not play against. The staff is friendly, the rooms were cleaned normally, the food is delicious (and like a winter ski resort in general, very much : )
However, there were a couple of downsides. Firstly, it was very cold in the lobby, in the hotel on the ground floor, the windows were made to the floor, there is no full-fledged heating, so you can’t sit up, but in the rooms opposite, the air conditioner worked so that you had to turn it off, it was very hot.
Secondly, about the tracks - there was very little snow on the tracks and it was unpleasant to ride, but this is a matter of chance, whoever is lucky with the weather. Here's another thing, infrastructure, in the district there is only one small hotel near the ski lift, and we also went to the indoor football field, our guys played with the Turks, and, pity everyone. Pretty boring. But in general, the hotel is a solid 5, made expensive and tastefully : ) If you want an alternative to Palandoken or Uludag, go there,
the nature is beautiful (but the tracks are still better on Uludag). . . Have a good rest everyone!
However, there were a couple of downsides. Firstly, it was very cold in the lobby, in the hotel on the ground floor, the windows were made to the floor, there is no full-fledged heating, so you can’t sit up, but in the rooms opposite, the air conditioner worked so that you had to turn it off, it was very hot.
Secondly, about the tracks - there was very little snow on the tracks and it was unpleasant to ride, but this is a matter of chance, whoever is lucky with the weather. Here's another thing, infrastructure, in the district there is only one small hotel near the ski lift, and we also went to the indoor football field, our guys played with the Turks, and, pity everyone. Pretty boring. But in general, the hotel is a solid 5, made expensive and tastefully : ) If you want an alternative to Palandoken or Uludag, go there,
the nature is beautiful (but the tracks are still better on Uludag). . . Have a good rest everyone!
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• 4